Field for manual switching of controller button prompts in Input

[LAN021 0]

9 hours ago, al2009man said:

It's not perfect, tho.  I'll need to figure out the way how to add "a Expand/Collapse" so I can put both Steam Deck/Controller prompts onto "Button prompt detection support" (as it's very much tied to Steam Input as a whole). also, formatting errors, as you can see on the bottom.

after that: I'll need to find a way to build a modes pages for "Steam Input Prompts Modes" (will be renamed later on), just so we can define what type of Button prompt helper the game will be using. 

That's really good so far. You don't want to use any of the suggestions from my post above? I think the tooltip for the field "Button prompt detection support" needs to be a little more thorough, see my proposed tooltip. And what about my first point, adding a field for switching controller button prompts in general to Additional information? (I think we can have it under that category instead of controller types.) Also, can't you have the Steam Input Prompts Modes in the comment, wouldn't that be enough?

An admin should also be able to help you with the issues you're having, but, according to Mr Aemony's post above, that's not their responsibility here.

Edited April 9 by LAN021

[al2009man 6]

On 4/9/2024 at 7:09 AM, LAN021 said:

That's really good so far. You don't want to use any of the suggestions from my post above? I think the tooltip for the field "Button prompt detection support" needs to be a little more thorough, see my proposed tooltip.

the idea for "[Steam Input] Button prompt detection support" (pending name) is that it'll be a dropdown where it shows you the Type of Button prompt detection system SteamInput will be using it for, similar to PlayStation Controller modes. But right now: a dedicated page document will be needed- but last I looked around: I don't think I got access to it.

In addition: this is where Steam Controller and Steam Deck prompts will be on the dropdown. (remember: it's increasingly tied towards Steamworks SDK/SteamInput, it makes sense to put it there.)

However, I am having issues getting the dropdown to work. 
 

If I can figured out how to solve this problem: there a likely chance that this idea will be temporarily dropped and will be leaving the setup be the same.

 

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Also, can't you have the Steam Input Prompts Modes in the comment, wouldn't that be enough?

hence: "[Steam Input] Button prompt detection support" (pending name).

 

 

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And what about my first point, adding a field for switching controller button prompts in general to Additional information? (I think we can have it under that category instead of controller types.)

I'm considering it, probably putting it under "Additional information". But it'll be reserved for later.

 

----

 

For now: I'll be taking a break from messing around. I may come back later on, with a more refreshed minds. (plus: was occupied with learning HDR Video Editing)

[LAN021 0]

8 hours ago, al2009man said:

the idea for "[Steam Input] Button prompt detection support" (pending name) is that it'll be a dropdown where it shows you the Type of Button prompt detection system SteamInput will be using it for, similar to PlayStation Controller modes. But right now: a dedicated page document will be needed- but last I looked around: I don't think I got access to it.

In addition: this is where Steam Controller and Steam Deck prompts will be on the dropdown. (remember: it's increasingly tied towards Steamworks SDK/SteamInput, it makes sense to put it there.)

However, I am having issues getting the dropdown to work. 

Isn't it enough to have separate fields instead of a dropdown? One called "Controller type button prompts" (new name to match the others) and then "Steam Deck button prompts" and "Steam Controller button prompts". Steam Deck and Steam Controller prompts are not that common, are they? (At least not Steam Controller any more.) They therefore don't need to be in the dropdown list and marked as false if button prompt detection is true. They can sometimes also be set manually whereas the controller type detection is only automatic. Either way, I think all three fields should be hidden if set to unknown.

So, in other words, I think it looks fine the way it is in your first example video. Just change the name of the button prompt detection field and update the tooltip to be more thorough and it could be added to the main template as is.

Here's my updated tooltip suggestion: "Steam Input's helper function can detect the type of controller being used and automatically show the correct prompts in the game (or the closest equivalent). Steam Input emulates XInput as normal if Steam Input API isn't used. The controller type can be changed in Steam's controller settings for certain XInput and DInput devices."

8 hours ago, al2009man said:

I'm considering it, probably putting it under "Additional information". But it'll be reserved for later.

Maybe you can start with that, see if it can be added to the main template, then continue your work with the Steam Input category.

I really like the work you're doing with this and hope you can solve the issues you're having. Maybe see if you can get help on Discord with them, if an admin cares enough to help (it's what they should do).

Edited April 12 by LAN021
Corrections/additions.

[al2009man 6]

On 4/12/2024 at 5:52 AM, LAN021 said:

Isn't it enough to have separate fields instead of a dropdown? One called "Controller type button prompts" (new name to match the others) and then "Steam Deck button prompts" and "Steam Controller button prompts". Steam Deck and Steam Controller prompts are not that common, are they? (At least not Steam Controller any more.) They therefore don't need to be in the dropdown list and marked as false if button prompt detection is true. They can sometimes also be set manually whereas the controller type detection is only automatic. Either way, I think all three fields should be hidden if set to unknown.

So, in other words, I think it looks fine the way it is in your first example video. Just change the name of the button prompt detection field and update the tooltip to be more thorough and it could be added to the main template as is.

 

ultimately decided to Dropdown that idea in favor of a Connection/Controller Models-style method.  Once again: these will be revised a bit for extra clarify. (and I might look into actually documenting that part the most.)

Right now: I only got these, and after getting the Sandbox template to go thru the main one: it now works and will be able to show the change in action.

Right now: I'm happy with the end-results, and I might be able to start with the pull request once the features I wanna implement gets finalized. (also able to fix formatting problems, yay!)

 

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Maybe you can start with that, see if it can be added to the main template, then continue your work with the Steam Input category.

Done. (working name tho)

 

now I'm off to work on adding Motion Sensor information.

[LAN021 0]

On 4/14/2024 at 12:29 AM, al2009man said:

ultimately decided to Dropdown that idea in favor of a Connection/Controller Models-style method.  Once again: these will be revised a bit for extra clarify. (and I might look into actually documenting that part the most.)

Outstanding work. I see now what you mean by having modes. I would perhaps change the descriptions to be a tooltip for the text "SIAPI Buttons" and "In-Game Buttons", if that is possible. I'd also change "buttons" to "button prompts", so "SIAPI button prompts" and "In-game button prompts". So when both modes are set, you have text that says "SIAPI and in-game button prompts", with a tooltip of its own. I hope that's possible.

On 4/14/2024 at 12:29 AM, al2009man said:

Done. (working name tho)

Outstanding work again. I'd change the name to include controller, just to clarify it's for controller prompts. My suggested name, "Manual selection of controller button prompts" would work, but "Manual controller button prompt selection" works just as well.

You just need to polish the wording and grammar a little and I think it's ready for implementation. I can help with updating the editing guide and adding a new/expanded section to the Steam Input page for this.

Edited April 15 by LAN021

[al2009man 6]

13 hours ago, LAN021 said:

Outstanding work. I see now what you mean by having modes. I would perhaps change the descriptions to be a tooltip for the text "SIAPI Buttons" and "In-Game Buttons", if that is possible. I'd also change "buttons" to "button prompts", so "SIAPI button prompts" and "In-game button prompts". So when both modes are set, you have text that says "SIAPI and in-game button prompts", with a tooltip of its own. I hope that's possible.

Not needed due to the title itself telling you exactly what it's meant to do.

 

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Outstanding work again. I'd change the name to include controller, just to clarify it's for controller prompts. My suggested name, "Manual selection of controller button prompts" would work, but "Manual controller button prompt selection" works just as well.

main reason is because certain games like Death Stranding and Metal Gear Solid: Master's Collection Volume 1 lets you forcefully change Keyboard/Mouse button prompts even if you use a Game Controller. Thus: it's a catch-all title.

It also accounts for certain Input devices like Wooting Keyboard or Azeron Gaming Keypad, both of which has a Analog Joystick, and having the ability to have the WASD output as a Analog Joystick (because Controller Input API Hell is a thing) and make the game only use Keyboard prompts because the game *lets* you stick to a specific Button prompt is neat for accessibility!

 

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 I can help with updating the editing guide and adding a new/expanded section to the Steam Input page for this.

you're happy to handle the SteamInput Button Modes variables documentation portion if you want. I already planned to handle that part myself.

[LAN021 0]

8 hours ago, al2009man said:

Not needed due to the title itself telling you exactly what it's meant to do.

To clarify, I meant the text underneath "SIAPI Buttons, In-Game Buttons" that says "Uses In-Game button prompts while SIAPI button prompts are used as a fallback." in the first picture of the second group. That text is auto-generated when the fields are set, correct? I meant that you can change that to a tooltip (displayed on mouse hover) instead of always showing it in the comment section. It could perhaps also be added to the main tooltip for the feature. It would be a long tooltip then, but it's a feature that requires a thorough explanation. Perhaps this was unclear due to the part I quoted, but I thought that the last sentence was enough.

8 hours ago, al2009man said:

main reason is because certain games like Death Stranding and Metal Gear Solid: Master's Collection Volume 1 lets you forcefully change Keyboard/Mouse button prompts even if you use a Game Controller. Thus: it's a catch-all title.

It also accounts for certain Input devices like Wooting Keyboard or Azeron Gaming Keypad, both of which has a Analog Joystick, and having the ability to have the WASD output as a Analog Joystick (because Controller Input API Hell is a thing) and make the game only use Keyboard prompts because the game *lets* you stick to a specific Button prompt is neat for accessibility!

You need to change the name to just "prompt" instead of "button prompt" then, as "button prompts" usually refer to controller prompts. As for games that have an option to lock the prompts to one type, either controller or KB/M, regardless of input, I think noting that in the comments is enough. Otherwise, you would need to note in the comment for each game what prompts can be changed, or, alternatively, have modes there as well. Lockable prompts are relatively rare and I know of a handful of games (some Team Ninja games, some The Legend of Heroes and Ys games ported by PH3 Games), which I can set quickly if this is implemented.

8 hours ago, al2009man said:

you're happy to handle the SteamInput Button Modes variables documentation portion if you want. I already planned to handle that part myself.

Ok, I'm still willing to assist with the wording and grammar. I'll include all the details about in-game and SIAPI prompts, of course.

I would like to hear what Aemony thinks at this point. Care to post, since you are watching the thread?

[al2009man 6]

14 hours ago, LAN021 said:

To clarify, I meant the text underneath "SIAPI Buttons, In-Game Buttons" that says "Uses In-Game button prompts while SIAPI button prompts are used as a fallback." in the first picture of the second group. That text is auto-generated when the fields are set, correct? I meant that you can change that to a tooltip (displayed on mouse hover) instead of always showing it in the comment section. It could perhaps also be added to the main tooltip for the feature. It would be a long tooltip then, but it's a feature that requires a thorough explanation. Perhaps this was unclear due to the part I quoted, but I thought that the last sentence was enough.

I recently tested the tooltip/abbr setup, and it actually works. I've added it.

 

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You need to change the name to just "prompt" instead of "button prompt" then, as "button prompts" usually refer to controller prompts. 

that's been changed.

 

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Ok, I'm still willing to assist with the wording and grammar. I'll include all the details about in-game and SIAPI prompts, of course.

I would like to hear what Aemony thinks at this point. Care to post, since you are watching the thread?

 

going forward: further discussion when it comes to merging should be moved to https://www.pcgamingwiki.com/wiki/Topic:Y2zpdr3b199gx303, 

[al2009man 6]

sorry for the long-winded two weeks wait. I've been busy.

Been in the polishing and editorial phases for a while. A lot of changes was made since then, like a ton of abbreviates changes (mouse hover) and added more stuffs (such as Keyboard/Mouse and Controller prompts section).

but to remained on-topic: the original name for "Manual controller button prompt selection" is now changed to "Input Prompt Override" based on community feedback over at PCGW discord server, and I like the name better. Going forward: this will become the official name. This also applies to "Steam Input prompt modes", as it also got a new name!

In addition: I added the documentation regarding "Steam Input prompt modes". I opted to go for a "hey, before you use those values: here's how you can properly test and verify them!" for this one. Don't expect a image highlight until I learned how to insert images. :P

Thus: everything is now officially locked in and further changes will not be needed (if needed: it'll be reserved for the Nintendo Controller Type update after merge request is finished, or a mod request that ask for assistence), it is now ready to be officially reviewed, be verified and be merged to the main Input section.  

I can't guarantee how long it'll take (due to the magnitude of changes)...but if it's anything like PlayStation Controller upgrade: it might take...time.