Age of Mythology, SafeDisc and Windows 10...

[Manticore 3]

I've got a question about the Age of Mythology page on PCGW.

 

It mentions that the game doesn't work on Windows 10, because the system doesn't support SafeDisc protection. That's only partially true, because when you install a no cd crack, the game works flawlessly - I tested it myself.

 

I once edited the page so that it actually mentioned this, but then my revision was removed for unclear reasons. I thought cracking a legally owned game wasn't a crime, according to American law, if there was no other way to run it.

 

Couldn't PCGW just mention that a No CD crack is required to run AoM (and all other SafeDisc protected games) on W10, without linking to the cracks themselves? Of course a disclaimer could be added that it is legal according to American law and the players should check their country's regulations on that before they crack their games.

 

Here are some links to back up this:

 

http://www.tomshardware.com/news/drm-dmca-jailbreaking-unlocking-iphone,10944.html

http://news.softpedia.com/news/it-s-now-legal-to-use-no-cd-crack-for-games-with-dead-drm-servers-495495.shtml

 

And besides, both Max Payne 2 and Black & White pages mention the necessary of a no cd crack.

 

So what do you think?

[Guest]

I made a thread about this a while ago, I think mentioning might've been okay? I really don't remember. You should ask on the IRC, or maybe someone can find the thread again.

 

Are you sure this issue hasn't been fixed though? I never use the original executables anyway seeing as some of my DVDs barely work.

[Garrett 214]

Are you sure this issue hasn't been fixed though? I never use the original executables anyway seeing as some of my DVDs barely work.

SafeDisc support is deliberately omitted from Windows 10 due to security concerns. A similar change was delivered to computers running Windows Vista or later as part of MS15-097; the SafeDisc service can be manually enabled on those versions of Windows after this update (the steps described there do not work on Windows 10).

 

Since SafeDisc games no longer work natively on modern systems after these changes it would be useful to have some standard way of handling this situation on the wiki. I had been planning on expanding the coverage of DRM specifics. I'll see about putting something together for SafeDisc.

[Guest]

SafeDisc support is deliberately omitted from Windows 10 due to security concerns.

I forgot about that. I would rather just provide the crack at this point, shouldn't this be fine under European laws?

[Mirh 103]

It mentions that the game doesn't work on Windows 10, because the system doesn't support SafeDisc protection. That's only partially true, because when you install a no cd crack, the game works flawlessly - I tested it myself.

I don't see any kind of contradiction.

You remove safedisc from the game, the game now works. Is this surprising?

I once edited the page so that it actually mentioned this, but then my revision was removed for unclear reasons.

Oh, I still remember that nice afternoon spent on those tutorials.

But, let's say, you have worded the thing a bit.. harshly for something this delicate.

I still remember my first edits were I even explicitly mentioned you needed ReLOADeD US crack to use FoV adjuster, and in 3 years yet nobody complained.

 

Though, if there are alternatives, this becomes shoddy.

I thought cracking a legally owned game wasn't a crime, according to American law, if there was no other way to run it.

I wouldn't stake my life on it, but cracking something you own is ok, as long as you keep it for yourself. Even describing how to do it should be lawful, given it's just "an idea", like tips for marijuana seedling or suicide.

Providing crack (gg for the pun) is not.

 

It wasn't your case though.

Couldn't PCGW just mention that a No CD crack is required to run AoM (and all other SafeDisc protected games) on W10, without linking to the cracks themselves? Of course a disclaimer could be added that it is legal according to American law and the players should check their country's regulations on that before they crack their games.

No, since alternative exists.

And I'm not talking of that driver tinkering (which even though is just a matter of clicks until W8.1, becomes a hell in 10)

I'm talking of something neat and fantastic as I did with Omikron.

 

Here are some links to back up this:

 

http://www.tomshardware.com/news/drm-dmca-jailbreaking-unlocking-iphone,10944.html

http://news.softpedia.com/news/it-s-now-legal-to-use-no-cd-crack-for-games-with-dead-drm-servers-495495.shtml

The second link totally doesn't apply (we aren't talking of multiplayer based games).

The first doesn't seem either, given it wouldn't be "testing or investigating", nor fixing vulnerabilities or security flaws (albeit this thing could apply to SafeDisc drm as a whole)

 

Since SafeDisc games no longer work natively on modern systems after these changes it would be useful to have some standard way of handling this situation on the wiki. I had been planning on expanding the coverage of DRM specifics. I'll see about putting something together for SafeDisc.

A "general" SafeDisc workaround "just in case" is ok-ish, I guess.

I mean: the EASY way for Vista/7/8 or the convoluted one for 10 (which in turn would have to link to a page where the magic of x64 driver signing enforcing is explained)

 

But as I wrote above, I find the "omikron way" much better (this in turn requires specific "guesses" different from game to game)

If not just for cases where games don't work, why not in light of the dream of first 2000s: being able to play without CD (and of course we dislike nocd).

 

Though... let's not forget this is not only about SafeDisc

 

And no, I'm not talking of SecuROM, goddamit

 

 

I wonder why nobody went rage when TAGES up to 5.2 (or 5.3?) had no x64 signed driver.

Or Starforce, which is even worse: 3.04 was the first version to be able to support Vista (either directly or via driver update). 3.05 was the first to support x64. 3.07 the first to support 7. And anything short of 4.5 won't work in 8 and newer.

I mean, people should be angry with publisher, rather than with -more or less willing- DRM creators, but in the end this doesn't matter.

 

Anyway these are way tougher than SafeDisc and I'm pretty sure there's no kind of static unpacker.

Though I confess I never documented about them, so anything might be possible.

 

So, tl;dr we'd still need a last resort idea here.

But I'd discuss of this in more appropriate places.

[ThatOneReaper 51]

Generally, giving information regarding pirated and/or cracked versions of games is not allowed. Regardless of the progress made in copyright laws specific to software, it's still a legal grey area for the time being.

 

That being said, there is one exception to this rule (that I personally see): If a game suffers from a game-breaking bug/crash and there is absolutely no other confirmed fix for it that is reliable (and legal), a No-CD crack/patch can be mentioned (but not directly linked). You don't need to mention the legality of said fix.

 

In other words, No-CD cracks/patches are to be considered the absolute last ditch solution to get a game to function. 

 

Considering games with SafeDisc are fundamentally broken on Windows 10, mentioning the No-CD crack solution would be appropriate in those cases (assuming that no other legal solutions are already available).

 

As a sidenote, I removed the No-CD fix from the Max Payne 2 page as there are already other legal solutions given to the issue.